2

John, do Dayton tires come from Dayton, Ohio?
Would they insulate well?

12/6/2009 10:59:38 PM

Quote :

"ambrosia why dont you just set yours at 80 so your fat ass could sweat some pounds off if you're gonna talk shit back it up with some science"

actually if it is colder she will burn more calories keeping her body temperature up..

12/6/2009 11:01:06 PM

^This, too

[Edited on December 6, 2009 at 11:02 PM. Reason : come on lafta]

12/6/2009 11:02:31 PM

Quote :

"ok lets talk common sense if house A is 60 degrees and it falls to 59 degrees, how much energy does it take to bring it up one degree to 60 now if house B is 80 degrees, and it fall to 79, how much energy does it take to bring it up one degree if you answered more energy for house B then you need to set your thermostat to 0 cause dont deserve heat"

but really though, who the fuck can live in an 80 degree house? pick a temperature you're comfortable with and leave it there.

if you want to save money, you save on heat by just never turning it on and wearing layers. if you don't want to sacrifice your own comfort for a few dollar bucks, then you set it as high as you want and just live.

12/6/2009 11:02:44 PM

what you set it to should be your preference
but when its really cold outside it matters little if you set it to 60 or 80

12/6/2009 11:04:09 PM

if it matters so "little" then why are you fussing? let her set it at 60. it works for her.

go return your movie.

12/6/2009 11:04:37 PM

never lower than 71, never higher than 73 (which is uncomfortably warm to me)

12/6/2009 11:04:43 PM

lafta your grasp of thermodynamics so tenuous it is appalling. I don't even have to say anything because you're doing such a good job coming off as a complete moron.

12/6/2009 11:04:59 PM

We don't have to say anything - we're all wrong, and he's right. It's some huge conspiracy that everyone but him is on.

12/6/2009 11:06:12 PM

Quote :

"if it matters so "little" then why are you fussing? let her set it at 60. it works for her. "

it matters little in terms of money, sorry i didnt know this was team ambrosia's terf

12/6/2009 11:06:29 PM

scud, we're not splitting hairs, its all about whether its worth to save a few cents or not
but thanks for sounding liek an expert but offering no evidnece, we got a lot of people like you around here

12/6/2009 11:08:00 PM

Quote :

"sorry i didnt know this was team ambrosia's terf"

You got it wrong.

It's Team Everybody But Lafta.

Quote :

"its all about whether its worth to save a few cents or not"

I'm really happy for you. Somehow, despite being nearly illiterate, you make so much money that a couple hundred dollars is a few cents.

Which lotto ticket did you win all that dough from?

[Edited on December 6, 2009 at 11:12 PM. Reason : sdf]

12/6/2009 11:11:14 PM

Quote :

"ok lets talk common sense if house A is 60 degrees and it falls to 59 degrees, how much energy does it take to bring it up one degree to 60 now if house B is 80 degrees, and it fall to 79, how much energy does it take to bring it up one degree if you answered more energy for house B then you need to set your thermostat to 0 cause dont deserve heat"

while the specific statement you made in that post is basically true (making the fairly valid assumption that the specific heat of air is basically constant at the different temperatures), that argument does nothing to back up the claim that the energy required to keep a house at 60 vs keeping a house at 80 when the outdoor air temperature is 30 is the same.

[Edited on December 6, 2009 at 11:14 PM. Reason : ]

12/6/2009 11:11:15 PM

^also note the discrepancy between his original argument and the scenario he laid out

12/6/2009 11:13:50 PM

yea.

the energy required to take 59 to 60 compared to 79 to 80 is ~ the same.

The energy required to keep a house at 60 @ 30 outside vs keeping a house at 80 @ 30 outside != the same.

12/6/2009 11:15:33 PM

okay you want me to destroy you? Fine...your supposed common sense is completely false. Maybe in a perfectly ideal laboratory situation with a hermetically sealed room your arguments could hold some water. The fact of the matter is that real homes in the real world have windows and doors and other fun stuff that open and close and leak all sorts of cold air.

Lets just pretend for a second that we are in a very simple situation and pretend that our leaky window is a simple heat exchanger.



It's pretty easy to see that even in the most simple case the higher the temperature differential the more energy you're losing.

12/6/2009 11:16:23 PM

^^how so? If its 30 outside the temp inside will always be coming down until the heater kicks in
if the heater kicks in when its say 1 or 5 degrees below its set temp then what does it matter if the set temp is 60 or 80 granted if the house started at the set temp



^ok that is a factor, but so are many other things, the only question is is it a big enough factor to consider when talking about saving money

if we're talking about lowering the thermostat by 10 degrees so i can save 20 bucks then forget it
like i said we're not splitting hairs

[Edited on December 6, 2009 at 11:19 PM. Reason : .]

12/6/2009 11:16:40 PM

BUT WHO THE FUCK WANTS TO LIVE IN AN 80 DEGREE HOUSE?? SERIOUSLY?!

12/6/2009 11:17:55 PM

Let me know if we need to dumb it down anymore for you to get it:

Quote :

" In science, Newton’s law of cooling states that the rate of heat loss dQ of a body is proportional to the difference in temperatures between the body and its surroundings, as shown below: [1] v where h is the (convective) heat transfer coefficient, A is the unit surface area of the body through which the heat is transferred, TB is the temperature of the surface of the body (solid), and TS is the temperature of the surroundings (fluid). [2] Newton’s law of cooling is generally limited to simple cases where the mode of energy transfer is convection, from a solid surface to a surrounding fluid in motion, and where the temperature difference is small, approximately less than 10º C. [3] When the medium into which the hot body is placed varies beyond a simple fluid, such as in the case of a gas, solid, or vacuum, etc., this becomes a residual effect requiring further analysis. [5] "

http://www.eoht.info/page/Newton’s+law+of+cooling

12/6/2009 11:20:23 PM

look at scud being all smart and what not

12/6/2009 11:20:53 PM

i keep the temp at 70 in the winter and wear a jacket. my feet are still cold, but i deal with it. I let it get down to 65 at night and warm up under the sheets.

12/6/2009 11:25:49 PM

yeah scud is so smart he forgot to read the quote

Quote :

"Newton’s law of cooling is generally limited to simple cases where the mode of energy transfer is convection, from a solid surface to a surrounding fluid in motion, and where the temperature difference is small, approximately less than 10º C."

and thanks for assuming we've all taken thermodynamics, that you post an equation without even saying what it is or what the variable are

12/6/2009 11:26:41 PM

scud i think you need to dumb it down for yourself, you're obviously not as smart as you'd like us to think you are

12/6/2009 11:27:54 PM

lafta it depends on the outside temperature

12/6/2009 11:31:04 PM

^^^that is not a hard equation to read haha. A=Area. T=temperature. That is about a simple as it can get besides the heat transfer coefficient.

If you want to get really picky (the outside air stays at 30F the entire 24 hours of the day) and make some assumptions, you could to argue that it takes roughly the same amount of temperature in each of these cases:

A. House A is the one kept at 60F. We have to assume it STARTS at 60F and the house is losing a set amount of BTU/hr resulting in a temperature drop large enough below 60F to kick the heat on.

B. House B is the one kept at 80F. We have to assume it STARTS at 80F and the house is losing a set amount of BTU/hr (same as case A) resulting in a temperature drop large enough below 80F to kick the heat on.

However, that is NOT a real life situation that can be used to determine if someone will save money keeping their thermostat at one temperature or another. So if that is the situation you want to argue lafta, then yes in a simple dumbed down scenario like that, that is an ok approximation.

But let's put this into a real life situation. How often is it 30 degrees F outside the entire day in the winter down here? If you are using an older thermostat and it is just set at 80 all day, the heat will be on more times during the day than the same house set at 60. It is as simple as that. The house kept at 80F will continually use more energy to maintain its temperature than the one kept at 60F. Period.

Whether that difference results in enough money to be worth the discomfort it may cause some people is up to each person.

And then for bonus knowledge, if you want to get really complicated and talking about COOLING, it is not the same amount of energy required to cool from 80 to 79 as it is 60 to 59.

[Edited on December 6, 2009 at 11:46 PM. Reason : ]

12/6/2009 11:36:55 PM

i wonder if they have any instructional videos on this particular subject at the RedBox?

12/6/2009 11:37:48 PM

^^obviously, its like comparing a house set at 80 to one set at 40, the one set at 40 will turn off as soon as the temp goes above 40 which is far more likely
that is not the question

the whole point is if the house will be heated regardless, and the outside temp does not approach the set temp then the two settings are similar enough for our purposes

12/6/2009 11:48:06 PM

the outside temperature doesnt have to get that close to the indoor set temperature due to insulation and glass exposure, number of external walls (if in an apartment) and other factors though (like leaving blinds open during the day on a sunlit side of the house). For example, today, where I live it was in the 30s in the morning but got up to mid to upper 40s during the day. My thermostat is set to 65 and my heat only came on probably 1x during the entire day between breakfast and 9pm or so because the indoor temperature was hanging around 67ish. If I had the thermostat set to 80, it would have been heating more during the night, and continued to come on more during the day.

Also, as I stated, I know this is outside the scope of the current discussion, but you should know that the argument you are making only applies to heating in case someone makes a similar thread this summer.

[Edited on December 7, 2009 at 12:09 AM. Reason : ]

12/6/2009 11:57:01 PM

you guys, and gals, fight about the most ridiculous shit

12/7/2009 12:01:52 AM

well, this "ridiculous shit" is what I do for my job, except on a much larger scale

[Edited on December 7, 2009 at 12:03 AM. Reason : ]

12/7/2009 12:02:49 AM

61 in here right now. heater hasn't clicked on since i got home a little after noon. thanks neighbors!

[Edited on December 12, 2009 at 1:30 PM. Reason : set on 60 i think]

12/12/2009 1:29:43 PM

trolling or dumb

you decide

12/12/2009 2:01:45 PM

mine's set at 55-60 i think

i've been curled up on the couch in a blanket though, so its all gravy

12/12/2009 2:02:56 PM

as long as i have my lambskin bedroom shoes i'm ok

12/12/2009 2:05:16 PM

put this in the "threads you shouldnt have made" category

12/12/2009 2:05:58 PM

my apt is usually at 60-61 and thats when im runnin the space heaters

[Edited on December 12, 2009 at 2:12 PM. Reason : t]

12/12/2009 2:11:45 PM

73 in my house. Pretty much stays there year round.

12/12/2009 2:21:13 PM

Lafta you are a missing some fundamentals of heat transfer and thermodynamics here. Say the weather outside is 45 and your house is at 65. It costs a hell of alot more to keep the house around 78-80 then it does 65...WHY!!?!? Because the rate of heat transfer increases with temperature difference...thus you have to provide more heat at a higher rate when you have it set to 78-80.

12/12/2009 2:26:30 PM

68-70 when we are home. 60 at night and during the weekdays.

My little electronic thermostat has saved us $texas in heating/cooling bills. Love that thing.

12/12/2009 2:27:50 PM

in the winter my thermostat stays around 73-75 all the time with the air handler constantly circulating

i dont like wearing extra clothes while im indoors, so i prefer to keep the thermostat up a little higher

12/12/2009 2:31:39 PM

progress energy loves me. i am constantly cold so it stays around 75-76. i live at the beach, so this setting is even more disturbing.

12/12/2009 2:31:53 PM

My parents are old, so they want to keep it around 76 in the house--or at least my mom does. Whenever I'm around it ninja it down to 70 for my dad, who doesn't bother anymore because she eyes it like a hawk.

12/12/2009 2:42:11 PM

I lafta so much

12/12/2009 3:15:07 PM

we keep it at about 71 year round

12/12/2009 3:16:35 PM

can anyone that's not very overweight sustain the temperature that cold?

12/12/2009 3:16:56 PM

LOL @ lafta

livin up to his name

dumbass!

12/12/2009 3:25:06 PM

Centipedes, in my vagina? It's more likely that you think!

Physics in my Chit Chat? It's more likely that you think!

12/14/2009 4:09:38 AM

lololololol lafta's complete thermodynamic's ignorance exposed ITT?

12/14/2009 4:58:45 AM

durrr

*than*

12/14/2009 5:26:44 AM

Where the fuck do you guys live?

My thermostat is still set to cool--actually had to use A/C less than a week ago.

Heater hasn't been on at all, and I've been entirely comfortable.

12/14/2009 7:12:45 AM