That's got to be the worst attempt to defend a logically fallacious position that I've ever seen. Skydaddy lovers always show their true lack of intelligence when the flaws in their skydaddy are pointed out.

5/16/2010 12:45:54 PM

Defend it from what? You didn't even argue against his position.

[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 1:07 PM. Reason : ]

5/16/2010 1:07:20 PM

Quote :

"do you seriously not understand WHY self-regulation doesn't work in a capitalist economy?"

yeah, man, there's no regulation to prevent this. It's not like people could sue or something. Oh, wait... the government put a maximum limit on the total bill BP could face. Yep, that regulation sure will help things, won't it? You really think we have unfettered capitalism, don't you, lol.

5/16/2010 1:53:20 PM

^^ that's likely because he doesn't understand it...if he's not coming into a thread to use a new multi-syllable word in excess or show off his "impressive" knife collection, he's usually lost

[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 3:05 PM. Reason : .]

5/16/2010 3:05:01 PM

Quote :

"i agree with you that this is indeed a perfect "example" of what happens when you allow self-regulation oh, wait, you're kidding? you think that this is just an "oops" situation and we should all just laugh it off? go fuck yourself you stupid piece of shit do you seriously not understand WHY self-regulation doesn't work in a capitalist economy? it's because industries are in it for the maximum net profit and they will do all that they can get away with to avoid ANYTHING that reduces net profit but hey, no one gives a rat's ass about your opinion because this is indeed enough of a fuck up for the administration to introduce greater regulation and the people, by and large, will support it"

I'm sorry my post hurt your feelings...hopefully this one won't do the same...

Explain what kind of "government regulation" could of prevented this "crisis" from occuring? Also, what cozy government issued job do you plan on coaxing your way into after graduation? Hopefully it'll compensate you enough to pay the interest on your student loans and the taxes necessary to implement all of these necessary "regulations".

[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 4:19 PM. Reason : ]

5/16/2010 4:07:54 PM

Quote :

"Explain what kind of "government regulation" could of prevented this "crisis" from occuring?"

1.) why do you keep putting crisis in quotation marks? this does actually fit the definition of an environmental crisis and so your implication to the contrary makes you a bit of an idiot (everything else makes you more than a bit, though)

2.) it's "occurring"...i realize that not everyone has basic spelling and grammar skills, but most modern browsers actually underline the misspelled word so that you can fix it before posting...give it a shot, eh?

3.) i'm not going to fall into the trap of asserting that government regulations can keep every bad thing from happening...i do believe, though, that reasonable regulations that are regularly enforced by an independent party would greatly reduce the likelihood of such mistakes...do you disagree? really?

Quote :

"Also, what cozy government issued job do you plan on coaxing your way into after graduation?"

i've worked for the fed, the state, and the private sector...being published with original research and multiple degrees tends to open up many options...how's your life working out?

Quote :

"Hopefully it'll compensate you enough to pay the interest on your student loans."

yeah, i dodged that bullet by getting academic scholarships and grants...not sure what your point is, though

5/16/2010 4:18:42 PM

its a simple question...someone with such a distinguished e-go as yourself should easily be able to answer bluntly...

Quote :

"but hey, no one gives a rat's ass about your opinion because this is indeed enough of a fuck up for the administration to introduce greater regulation and the people, by and large, will support it"

again... Explain what kind of "government regulation" could of prevented this "crisis" from occurring?

Quote :

"3.) i'm not going to fall into the trap of asserting that government regulations can keep every bad thing from happening...i do believe, though, that reasonable regulations that are regularly enforced by an independent party would greatly reduce the likelihood of such mistakes...do you disagree? really?"

contradict yourself much??

[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 4:34 PM. Reason : ]

5/16/2010 4:26:34 PM

Quote :

"No Corpus Christi or Galveston trips for me. I miss the Outer Banks."

Dude have you ever been to Corpus? That place is a shit hole. I did my navy flight training there and that city SUCKS. There are a few places that dont suck, along the bay and down town but as soon as you go inland it gets real shitty real fast. Pretty much anything along the SPID sucks. The only decent place outside of Corpus is Padre Island.

5/16/2010 4:27:08 PM

Quote :

"e-go"

really? now you're just TRYING to be stupid

the most likely cause of the initial explosion was related to actions performed by bp and halliburton using a process they knew to be faulty...regulations are in place that dictate that steps must be taken to prevent leaks, but there are only minimal regulations (if any) in place that dictate what those steps must actually be...the oil companies have almost free rein to choose which methods they use and bp chose the cheapest, which was proven to be dangerous and faulty

but hey, i'm sure the issue of cost NEVER entered into the company's decision to use the cheapest, least effective, and most dangerous method...self-regulation is working out GREAT

[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 4:35 PM. Reason : .]

5/16/2010 4:34:22 PM

Quote :

"e-go"

LOL

5/16/2010 4:35:23 PM

ahahahha

5/16/2010 4:38:46 PM

Quote :

"contradict yourself much??"

i...what? when did i contradict myself? please to directly compare the two instances in question

let's ALSO not forget the fact that these companies are not required to have a series of emergency shutoff valves in place the same way similar industries (natural gas in particular) are...ocean drilling is a wide-open industry with comparatively little government regulation

regulation that, if enacted in the same way it is with similar industries, could easily have prevented this from happening in the first place

let's be honest for a moment, kid...you're on board with the "hate the man" movement and so now it's just the mean old fed picking on the poor little overworked oil company...please start paying more attention to FACTS and less attention to the tea party, okay? regulation is not and should not be a dirty word and while i will admit that there IS a fair amount of regulation out there that does more damage than good, there's a MUCH larger amount that does what it's supposed to...you just don't know it because it IS doing the job it's supposed to be doing

[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 4:51 PM. Reason : .]

5/16/2010 4:47:35 PM

Quote :

"i'm sure the issue of cost NEVER entered into the company's decision to use the cheapest, least effective, and most dangerous method...self-regulation is working out GREAT "

it is working out great. BP is finding out the painful way that there was nothing cheap about the method they used. They're going to spend billions on cleanup and lose billions more in oil proceeds from the lost well, lawsuits over the dead workers, the lost rig, etc. They'll change their internal policies on their own as a result of this fiasco. If the government was responsible for telling people the actual work steps to be taken, we'd be stuck using technology that is 100 years outdated.

5/16/2010 5:24:23 PM

Quote :

" but hey, no one gives a rat's ass about your opinion because this is indeed enough of a fuck up for the administration to introduce greater regulation and the people, by and large, will support it "

Quote :

" 3.) i'm not going to fall into the trap of asserting that government regulations can keep every bad thing from happening...i do believe, though, that reasonable regulations that are regularly enforced by an independent party would greatly reduce the likelihood of such mistakes...do you disagree? really?"

Anyone with basic reading comprehension skills can see that these statements contradict each other. First you said the administration needs to introduce greater regulation and the people will support it. Secondly, you said yourself “government regulations can't keep every bad thing from happening”. You still haven’t explained how some kind of government regulations which you originally stated would solve this problem and future problems after reading my initial post.

Secondly kid, you wanted some truth?? Heres some economic truths for you…

The US national debt is currently at $ 12 trillion and growing substantially daily with interest..

funny that the most profitable companies in the world are energy companies...exxonmobil, chevron, shell, etc...

now wouldn't it be nice if we could introduce some new regulations which would as a front "prevent evil capitalistic oil companies from destroying the environment via oil spills".. all while siphoning profits to finance this ridiculous entitlement government..which by your own admission needs to become more gluttonous…thats essentially what has occurred with all these new regulatory overhauls which are hitting many industries..

Many new graduates wonder why companies aren't hiring and why the unemployment rates are so high...it is simple to understand..industries are being regulated to the point where they are hitting a wall where its no longer profitable to do business within United States jurisdiction thus we will always be behind to less regulated economies..

[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 5:35 PM. Reason : ]

5/16/2010 5:33:52 PM

Quote :

" BP is finding out the painful way that there was nothing cheap about the method they used"

Not only BP, but the families of the dead workers, devastated fishing industries on the gulf coast, and affected tourist areas on the gulf coast, not to mention the potentially irreparable harm to the wild life in the area.

Regardless of regulation, the risk of accidents is always there. But you have to be very naive not to realize that the oil companies and the gov. do have way too close of a relationship. The regulation on the oil companies, just like the regulation on the banks (still to this day), is largely superficial. A lot of the deals work to protect profits and partnerships more than the nation's interests. How else to you explain the statutory limit on damages set at 75 million? BP wisely is ignoring the regulation, but it shouldn't have been in there in the first place.

And considering other countries require stricter standards, BP (or whoever contracted the well design) definitely knew of the risks of their cost-cutting.

I don't think anyone is suggesting though that the gov. create the operating manuals. But the gov. should require wells to be equipped reasonably with the latest safety technology, at a minimum.

When you are talking about an oil well that creates an environmental disaster that affects the coastline of multiple states, I don't see why anyone would sit back and wait for a disaster to happen before people learn a lesson vs. actively looking for hazardous design decisions.

Quote :

"Many new graduates wonder why companies aren't hiring and why the unemployment rates are so high...it is simple to understand..industries are being regulated to the point where they are hitting a wall where its no longer profitable to do business within United States jurisdiction thus we will always be behind to less regulated economies."

This is complete bullshit. You've been duped by people protecting their own financial interests.

It's not your job to defend the multibillion $$ companies. You are supposed to look out for your own interests, not buy into their propaganda. Or read some Upton Sinclair sometime to see what happens in "less regulated economies."

[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 5:39 PM. Reason : ]

5/16/2010 5:37:17 PM

Quote :

"Anyone with basic reading comprehension skills can see that these statements contradict each other. First you said the administration needs to introduce greater regulation and the people will support it. Secondly, you said yourself “government regulations can't keep every bad thing from happening”."

OBVIOUSLY these statements are direct opposites...good job, you found waldo

Quote :

"You still haven’t explained how some kind of government regulations which you originally stated would solve this problem and future problems after reading my initial post."

actually, i have, but as you've demonstrated, your reading comprehension skills are sub-par and as such, keep you from understanding simple concepts...while i do sympathize with you regarding your learning disability, there's not much i can do to help you out

Quote :

"Secondly kid, you wanted some truth?? Heres some economic truths for you… The US national debt is currently at $ 12 trillion and growing substantially daily with interest.. funny that the most profitable companies in the world are energy companies...exxonmobil, chevron, shell, etc..."

thank you for these truths...i'm not quite sure what they have to do with the billions upon billions of oil sitting in the gulf waters, but i'm glad you were able to use google

maybe next year, when you're wearing big boy diapers, you'll learn what "relevant" means!

Quote :

"now wouldn't it be nice if we could introduce some new regulations which would as a front "prevent evil capitalistic oil companies from destroying the environment via oil spills".. all while siphoning profits to finance this ridiculous entitlement government..which by your own admission needs to become more gluttonous…thats essentially what has occurred with all these new regulatory overhauls which are hitting many industries.."

1.) lay off the quotes...you don't understand how they're supposed to be used, so you might as well give it up

2.) when you say something like "by your own admission," it implies (actually, it blatantly states) that the person actually said something in particular..."gluttonous" is not even remotely a synonym for "regulation," so i'm not quite sure what it is you think i've admitted

3.) i'm not surprised you don't understand what you're writing, but can you please (please?) make an effort? i realize you're new, and this IS chit chat after all, but it's would be greatly appreciated if you could make a concerted effort to remain coherent and cohesive

Quote :

"Many new graduates wonder why companies aren't hiring and why the unemployment rates are so high"

no, they don't...MOST of them can read newspapers and watch the news and understand the basics...obviously there are some folks like you that haven't a clue what's going on, but i daresay that if we're talking about actual graduates, they have the vaguest of notions regarding what's going on in the world around them

Quote :

"it is simple to understand"

you would think so, but:

Quote :

"industries are being regulated to the point where they are hitting a wall where its no longer profitable to do business within United States jurisdiction thus we will always be behind to less regulated economies"

implies that you have discovered a new word (hint: it's "regulation") that you're just itching to use whenever possible, despite not understanding the difference between regulations and laws...you also, quite obviously, have difficulty understanding how laws and regulations are generated, enacted, and enforced, as well as their effect on a given industry...regulations (different than laws!) are but a component of why many industries choose to manufacture outside of the US, but since many of these regulations you hate so much give us a standard of living higher than many of the places these companies DO choose to be located in, it's not gonna change

Quote :

"it is working out great. BP is finding out the painful way that there was nothing cheap about the method they used. They're going to spend billions on cleanup and lose billions more in oil proceeds from the lost well, lawsuits over the dead workers, the lost rig, etc. They'll change their internal policies on their own as a result of this fiasco. If the government was responsible for telling people the actual work steps to be taken, we'd be stuck using technology that is 100 years outdated."

refer to moron's post above...he nailed it

[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 7:19 PM. Reason : .]

5/16/2010 7:15:25 PM

I think ncsufanalum thinks regulations=taxes

How do you siphon profits through regulations? unless you count oil companies constantly violating the regulations and being fined for it (which would be their own fault). Then he talks about how regulations are somehow putting people out of work?

5/16/2010 7:56:07 PM

blah blah blah

personally attack me all you would like

you STILL haven't logically backed nor explained YOUR contradictory statements of how more "government regulation can fix problems like this" and "government can't fix all problems"

you would think after 33401 posts you would be able to directly answer questions without having to resort to the typical flame and troll responses....your inflated, self-indulgent, egotistical, nonsense is hysterical to read..please keep it coming!


[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 10:28 PM. Reason : ]

5/16/2010 10:27:23 PM

Jesus this turned into words.

Quote :

"you STILL haven't logically backed nor explained YOUR contradictory statements of how more "government regulation can fix problems like this" and "government can't fix all problems""

How are these contradictory? Government regulation can fix problems but the government can't fix all problems. Seems self-explanatory.

5/16/2010 10:29:36 PM

Quote :

"blah blah blah"

yes, yes, we're all aware that this is all you're saying

Quote :

"personally attack me all you would like"

i'd call anyone out for willful ignorance...don't think you're that special, because you're not

Quote :

"you STILL haven't logically backed nor explained YOUR contradictory statements of how more "government regulation can fix problems like this" and "government can't fix all problems""

wolfpackgrrr took care of this one for me...see above, maybe you'll finally get it when everyone points out your high level of stupid

Quote :

"you would think after 33401 posts you would be able to directly answer questions without having to resort to the typical flame and troll responses"

you have half a point...i happily troll/flame whenever the mood suits me, but in what i assumed was originally intended to be a relatively serious discussion, i only resort to trolling/flaming when it's obvious that i'm responding to someone with below average intellect

Quote :

"your inflated, self-indulgent, egotistical, nonsense common sense is hysterical to read impossible for me to understand..please keep it coming!"

fixed it for you, kid

[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 10:36 PM. Reason : wolfpackgrrr]

5/16/2010 10:35:09 PM

Quote :

"How are these contradictory? Government regulation can fix problems but the government can't fix all problems. Seems self-explanatory."

MY point exactly..so how will increased regulation solve this issue or any other potential events in the future?? Do we hire third-party regulators to enforce a new set of rules and regulations to prevent this from happening? Apparently according to the all knowing quagmire this is the solution...The end result is the death of a business entity due to it being impossible to enforce the rules.

Quote :

"but hey, no one gives a rat's ass about your opinion because this is indeed enough of a fuck up for the administration to introduce greater regulation and the people, by and large, will support it"

can't wait to see this "greater regulation" that your big daddy sends in..good luck finding a job when you graduate quagmire...

[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 10:43 PM. Reason : ]

[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 10:46 PM. Reason : ]

5/16/2010 10:37:05 PM

Yeah, I guess we should allow industry to run themselves in the same way they did during the robber baron days.

5/16/2010 10:39:03 PM

Quote :

"MY point exactly"

i don't think so...i'm pretty sure it was my point, but you're still not getting it, even after wolfpackgrrr emphasized the words that defined the point itself

Quote :

"so how will increased regulation solve this issue or any other potential events in the future?? Do we hire third-party regulators to enforce a new set of rules and regulations to prevent this from happening? The end result is the death of a business entity due to it being impossible to enforce the rules."

what the hell? do you even read what you write? you're saying a business dies because it is impossible for it to enforce the rules? why is the business enforcing the rules? this makes even less sense than the drivel you were spewing earlier

[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 10:40 PM. Reason : .]

5/16/2010 10:39:48 PM

lol...looks like you have been doing this for years on this site haha..you are a real internet winner!!!

Quote :

"EMCE Goof Juice Dispenser 67774 Posts user info edit post eventually, according to quagmire, bobbydigital will have said something completely different from what was actually said and quagmire will be arguing with himself. it's fucking hilarious to watch this man in action... watch as he literally constructs BOTH sides of the argument.....and argues with himself the best part is going back at a later time and reading the thread all at once...you'll see what I mean. then go back and read the thread again....but read quagmire's posts with an english accent. then irish FUCKING HILARIOUS "

http://thewolfweb.com/message_topic.aspx?topic=542398&page=3

5/16/2010 11:02:17 PM

ncsufanalum seems to be the confused one here

5/16/2010 11:12:13 PM

post stalking like whoa

5/16/2010 11:14:22 PM

How do i delete this thread?

5/16/2010 11:32:52 PM

ask a mod nicely and maybe he'll do it

5/16/2010 11:33:48 PM

Sorry, once you make a thread it's no longer your property, it belongs to TWW.

5/16/2010 11:44:28 PM

why is there Soap Box in my Chit Chat?

5/16/2010 11:45:25 PM

^ This has turned into Stalker Box.

5/17/2010 1:02:59 AM

Now they're saying 25,000 barrels a day are being leaked.

So about 675,000 barrels or 28 million gallons

5/17/2010 8:58:27 AM

TAKE ONE DOWN


PASS IT AROUND


44.699999999 BILLIONS OF BARRELS OF OIL ON THE WALL

5/17/2010 9:00:23 AM

I stopped reading this thread when the poster doesnt realize how absurd a 4 billion barrel number was.

5/17/2010 9:03:31 AM

^^hahahaha I hadn't even read the second page of this thread and that song was already going thru my head

5/17/2010 9:59:57 AM

if nothing else, the 60 minutes interview last night helped me to understand a) how these things are supposed to work and b) why this one failed...

fascinating really

5/17/2010 10:02:07 AM

^ Yeah they had an interesting interview on Countdown the other day with a guy explaining how the tests for these blow out things are supposed to be run and how BP usually does them.

5/17/2010 9:00:12 PM

clearly we weren't running out of non-renewable resources quickly enough for BP......

supply and demand, well played sirs

5/17/2010 9:25:53 PM

5/19/2010 9:19:30 AM

Summary of Chart: We're screwed

5/19/2010 9:31:16 AM

I still support off shore drilling.

5/19/2010 11:23:54 AM

I still support thinking that you're an idiot.

5/19/2010 11:26:19 AM

if everything goes right, the tail will drift off to Cuba instead of towards Florida

let's all keep our fingers crossed for favorable currents

5/19/2010 11:29:08 AM

what an overly busy graphic.

5/19/2010 11:29:26 AM

soap box ITT

5/19/2010 11:32:26 AM